Question about ESP guitars lineup

Discussion in 'Standard Guitars' started by e7lek, Apr 4, 2019.

  1. StrmRidr

    StrmRidr Hide your Jacksons

    Messages:
    547
    Likes Received:
    363
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2013
    Location:
    NB, Canada
    I think you are really underestimating how many people use and like EMGs. Most guitarists outside of this forum don't give a damn about tone woods.
     
    Mathemagician likes this.
  2. efiltsohg

    efiltsohg SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    188
    Likes Received:
    155
    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2019
    They put EMGs in everything because they are immensely popular, not sure why you think nobody likes them

    also virtually every ESP model has versions with Duncans too
     
  3. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

    Messages:
    5,608
    Likes Received:
    1,734
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2013
    Location:
    Chicago
    Most guitarists under the age of 30 don't even believe in tonewoods. It's because we grew up with the internet. Most of us don't believe in anything once we find out it has been debunked. I think people who were adults pre-internet have this mentality that they know better based on their personal experiences, whereas younger people will actually reject their own first hand impressions in lieu of what research/mass consensus shows to be true.

    As an example, I played a guitar with a really thick neck recently, and I thought it had great tone. I might have believed that the thick neck caused the guitar to have the fantastic tone, but instead I really do think it's just a coincidence. It almost certainly must have been the pickups. I should really get an Alnico Classic Plus in my SG.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
    Mathemagician and StrmRidr like this.
  4. AkiraSpectrum

    AkiraSpectrum SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    5,438
    Likes Received:
    1,252
    Joined:
    May 30, 2010
    Location:
    Ontario Canada
    I played that model in a shop maybe 6 months ago and it was hard to put it down. It was a phenomenal guitar.

    Yeah, the one you're looking at just has the regular 81/60 combo. Have you used these before? The EMG 81 is not really my thing, but it works great for certain sounds, and is that 'classic' EMG tone. I do however really like the 60 in the neck, it is great for just about everything in my opinion.

    In my opinion, if you really want/like a guitar then get it, pickups can be changed out immediately or over time. Depending on the store you order the guitar from you may be able to get them to offer you a deal if you buy the guitar and new pickups (maybe like a discount or free install or something).
     
  5. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    2,534
    Likes Received:
    2,102
    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Location:
    china
    And really other then like kiesel 2000k is still production guitar territory. They are going to put in what most of their users are going to be into.

    I can think of only a few non custom ordered guitars I’d be ok with without a pickup swap
     
    AkiraSpectrum and StevenC like this.
  6. tedtan

    tedtan SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    4,379
    Likes Received:
    843
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2009
    Location:
    Never Neverland
    I get what you're saying, and I know several people who think like this. But just because a guitar sells at a certain price point doesn't mean that it is spec'ed out 100% to your satisfaction, so you'll end up having to pass on a lot of guitars that are close, but not quite perfect.

    I say that since you like the guitar, get it and change the pickups. You'll forget the extra 150 euros for the new pickups pretty quickly, but you'll have the guitar that is now spec'ed out 100% to your liking as long as you care to hold on to it. Plus, you can sell the EMGs pretty easily.
     
    AkiraSpectrum and StevenC like this.
  7. e7lek

    e7lek SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    208
    Likes Received:
    79
    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2011
    Location:
    Cambridge, UK
    Yes i like what you're saying. I think its the way to go. Either that or get a les paul custom (black beauty) which is what im trying to decide between :nlb:
     
  8. Ikke

    Ikke A Dream Cartographer

    Messages:
    656
    Likes Received:
    656
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2012
    Location:
    United States
    This thread seems quite...uninformed to say the least. Also, I'm sure what you consider a high end ESP. Most ESP's come with Duncans from my experience. I like talking about ESP, so here we go:

    ESP Original
    - Horizon I, II, III, PT, CTM = Duncans
    - M-II DX = Duncans
    - M-II CTM = EMG
    - Maverick = Duncans
    - M-Seven = Duncans
    - Amorous-CTM = Duncans
    - Stream-GT = Duncans
    - Eclipse-CTM = EMG
    - FRX = Duncans
    - Potbelly = Duncans
    - Throbber-STD = Duncans
    - Snapper AS, AL, CTM = Duncans
    - Viper = Duncans
    - Forest-GT = Duncans

    So 2/13 high end ESP series use EMG's. USA's are made to customer specs so, they don't count. E-II is not a high end ESP in my opinion.

    As an anecdote, the main reason I don't use EMG's is because I didn't want a battery in my guitar.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
  9. e7lek

    e7lek SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    208
    Likes Received:
    79
    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2011
    Location:
    Cambridge, UK
    Those are some good points my man
     
  10. trem licking

    trem licking SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    496
    Likes Received:
    145
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Location:
    MI
    I too, do not like dealing with batteries. EMGs sound awesome though
     
  11. Andromalia

    Andromalia Pardon my french

    Messages:
    7,588
    Likes Received:
    1,321
    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2009
    Location:
    Paris, France
    My UltraTone came with Duncans too, you can add that to your list.
     
  12. jonsick

    jonsick SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    440
    Likes Received:
    50
    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    Location:
    UK
    I have heard it said before that EMGs mask the "tone" of the guitar. This is simply not true. I have three ESP SV Standards that would all like to disagree with you! Three of the same guitar (bar one being white, two being black) that all sound different.

    That said, EMGs are great pickups. If they're not your cup of tea, the world is your oyster. To be fair, if they all came with Duncan JB/59 combos, people would complain there too!
     
    AkiraSpectrum likes this.
  13. jonsick

    jonsick SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    440
    Likes Received:
    50
    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    Location:
    UK
    I think I'm the only one that didn't jump on that Fluence train. My Satchel came with fluences... which are now EMGs :) Much happier and more at home.
     
    JD27 and AkiraSpectrum like this.
  14. ascl

    ascl SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    307
    Likes Received:
    133
    Joined:
    May 6, 2012
    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    I picked up an Eclipse last year in Japan... and swapped the EMGs for Fluence, but I am going to swap back. Glad there is someone else that doesn't think they are the bees knees!
     
    JD27 likes this.
  15. Andromalia

    Andromalia Pardon my french

    Messages:
    7,588
    Likes Received:
    1,321
    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2009
    Location:
    Paris, France
    2/10 troll. Not even the benefit of innovation.
     
  16. narad

    narad SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    7,641
    Likes Received:
    6,274
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Location:
    Tokyo
    Research? I'd like to take a scientific perspective on the issue, but the only time I ever see someone attempt to debunk "tonewood"* it's some pseudo-sciencey blog post or some guy attaching pickups to 3 logs and recording the result. I really don't feel like anyone with tons of hands-on experience with alder and maple strats would think their sound properties are randomly distributed.

    *which we might define as construction material making a perceivable difference on sound, and those material properties tending to be more consistent within a species or family of wood than between them.
     
    Schmeer and StevenC like this.
  17. jonsick

    jonsick SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    440
    Likes Received:
    50
    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2012
    Location:
    UK
    I didn't hate the fluences. And I'd be happy to admit it's my own whims and fancies; I've been using EMG since the year dot and to me there's nothing better than the good ol' 81/85. I'd admit even to preferring the older pickups with the hook up wires soldered into the pickup rather than the quick-connect system. I have a bunch of hardwired in the parts drawer.
     
  18. Adieu

    Adieu SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    304
    Likes Received:
    159
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2010
    Location:
    Moscow
    This was sorta-true... 20 years ago

    In recent times, there's been a crapton of ESP models with Seymours, DiMarzios, BKPs, Fishmans, you name it
     
  19. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

    Messages:
    5,608
    Likes Received:
    1,734
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2013
    Location:
    Chicago
    It was years ago that I read it, maybe you've seen it too, where the world's most accomplished violinists couldn't pass the Pepsi taste test between a stratovarius and one made out of carbon fiber or something.

    I understand that woods have different physical properties that might affect tone from a sonic perspective; I just also understand that human being perception has limits. But then again there are exceptional people. Maybe you have the Spidey sense.
     
  20. narad

    narad SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    7,641
    Likes Received:
    6,274
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Location:
    Tokyo
    I haven't seen one that was stradivarius vs carbon fiber, but I saw one where it was double blind listening with pro violinists and instruments across a wide variety of eras (including strads) that found essentially the same results. However, I think you're not being very evidence driven yourself to extrapolate from that to guitars and wrap it up like it's scientifically concluded that wood properties have no systematic and predictable effect on sound.

    a.) the listeners were asked if they could identify the stradivarius, not if they could distinguish the instruments by some material property. If you check their descriptions, they're strongly prefering this-or-that in the instrument sound. The instruments didn't sound the same. They were not played (knowingly) many stadivariuses and then told to (blindly) identify more.

    b.) violins are typically constructed from the same types of woods.

    This study only tells us that people have strong biases in assigning preferable qualities to things we are told are preferable. It says nothing regarding "tonewood", i.e., that woods species/density/physical properties have predictable consequences on instrument sound.
     
    vilk likes this.

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.