Matrix Resurrections....

StevenC

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In general even the One persona in the first trilogy felt annoying as hell. Especially if we're talking about a simulated world that theoretically could be hacked and the laws of nature rewritten, as they were doing. So was Neo the only one with latent superhacker abilities that were a quirk of his code instead, you know code cracking experience? In that regard anyone would be able to manipulate the virtual world of Matrix and the fact that Trinity could also is not a strange concept. In the end Neo has his all glory back but Trinity is on equal footing. This time though is not the power of a quirk in the code but the power of love that transcends everything, the love to kick ass and chew bubble gum!

In term of inclusiveness in movies, I'm for it in modern and futuristic movies. However having medieval themed movies or Victorian movies with Asian and Black people as part of the everyday society and even the higher society is ignorant and is causing more bad than good. Because non binary people and other races were sooooooo well received in history...
They get Smith to say it pretty clearly in this movie "Anybody can be The One". It's not like Neo is the only person in the series with superhuman powers. Morpheus can jump between buildings.
 

Edika

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They get Smith to say it pretty clearly in this movie "Anybody can be The One". It's not like Neo is the only person in the series with superhuman powers. Morpheus can jump between buildings.

I didn't remember that line from Smith. Yeah all of the "outsiders" of the Matrix could manipulate the code to some extent, as they were saying in the first movies, but only Neo was supposed to be able to donwhatever he wanted with the Matrix and rewrite reality. As they both did in the end of the movie where the changed the color of the sky.

And just because I found this funny:
Keanu.jpg
 
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IwantTacos

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It's a fantasy world, they don't have to make everyone white just because it's based off a polish book/game. I didn't find it as blatant as other examples tbh.
I have no problem with representation when it's done well, but most of these companies shit the bed in that regard.

The BBC is super guilty of the whole woke tokenism shit, though they're doing it in a far worse way. I remember one show aimed at teaching kids about ancient Rome and how they affected Britain, where the majority of characters were black, which is just false. There were North African auxiliary legions/soldiers, but they weren't really in Britain from what the records show.
Netflix has been super blatant about it as well, but they're not just checking the skin color box, they want gender/sexuality spectrum too. Damn near every show they make anymore has ALL the gender/sexuality representation, regardless of whether it's organic in the context of the show. They chucked nonbinary and trans kids into Sex Education and Big Mouth, and it was so obviously forced.


Hopefully in the next couple of years all this shit will actually be integrated into the writing or world building, so it'll be less obvious.

anti-woke rant.

like if you are going to put minority characters in shows sometimes they are gonna die and sometimes they are going to be the bad guy.

we don't need a news report or twitter storm every time that shit happens.

on topic matrix crap

Now that I thought about it..the analyst's matrix is a completely different matrix from the first one....

it didn't have to keep the divide by zero error of the first one. They wrote it with Neo and trinity coded into it. Whatever. It's fine. I mean it matters absolutely zero just like the movie. So whatever.
 

Randy

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They get Smith to say it pretty clearly in this movie "Anybody can be The One". It's not like Neo is the only person in the series with superhuman powers. Morpheus can jump between buildings.

That kinda defeat the purpose of being called "The One" doesn't it? Have I been getting the definition of the word "one" wrong? :lol:
 

StevenC

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That kinda defeat the purpose of being called "The One" doesn't it? Have I been getting the definition of the word "one" wrong? :lol:
As above, new Matrix doesn't have a One, but a two.

The context being Smith's ability to be anywhere at any time. I interpret it as meaning there's nothing specifically special about Neo, but there is something special about everyone believing in him. Anybody could be The One doesn't mean everyone is, but whoever is decided as The One isn't necessarily predetermined to be.
 

Rev2010

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As long as they have that generic British-y "fantasy" accent, amirite?

That's one of those things that has always irked the shit out of me. Show/movie set in Rome - fake English accents, not fake Italian accents. Show/movie set in Egypt... fucking EGYPT! - fake English accents as well. Show/movie set in some made up fantasy realm - fake English accents.

What gives? Can't actors/actresses just talk in their normal tongue?, cause the audience isn't somehow feeling more immersed in the film with these bullshit accents that aren't any more in-place for the setting.
 

Randy

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As above, new Matrix doesn't have a One, but a two.

The context being Smith's ability to be anywhere at any time. I interpret it as meaning there's nothing specifically special about Neo, but there is something special about everyone believing in him. Anybody could be The One doesn't mean everyone is, but whoever is decided as The One isn't necessarily predetermined to be.

So it's like a mix between Elf and The Santa Clause? Anyone can be the One as long as we believe in ourselves? :lol: Idk, still doesn't sound like a narrative that improves the story or builds the world any better, just "different".
 

StevenC

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So it's like a mix between Elf and The Santa Clause? Anyone can be the One as long as we believe in ourselves? :lol: Idk, still doesn't sound like a narrative that improves the story or builds the world any better, just "different".
Exactly!

Though, yeah this is a slightly different construction of "the world" built around Neo and Trinity, so that may mean in this specific Matrix there are exactly two people who can be The One together. It implies that Tom Anderson wasn't a significant person in the original Matrix until Morpheus decided so, but in this new Matrix he is incredibly significant.

Alternatively, maybe Neo is special originally and in the real world for some magic reason, but that still results in the new Matrix being built around Trinity and Neo.

I suppose it raises questions about the Oracle and exactly how much she was pulling the strings. The machines gave Oneness to a random person, so we know that much is special about Neo but nothing else is necessarily. He was also the 6th One.
 

KnightBrolaire

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That's one of those things that has always irked the shit out of me. Show/movie set in Rome - fake English accents, not fake Italian accents. Show/movie set in Egypt... fucking EGYPT! - fake English accents as well. Show/movie set in some made up fantasy realm - fake English accents.

What gives? Can't actors/actresses just talk in their normal tongue?, cause the audience isn't somehow feeling more immersed in the film with these bullshit accents that aren't any more in-place for the setting.
Yessss, I hate that when they all just have generic british accents in period pieces.
The funnier one is when it's a period piece that takes place outside the US and they have american accents. I tried watching some series about ancient egypt where they all had american accents and had to shut it off because it was so distracting.
 

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Not going to wade through five pages of fighting here. :lol:

I liked it. It wasn't as good as the original, but it was far better than the two sequels. Sure, there were some holes here and there, but it was fun to watch, and had a sense of humor about itself (little things like the creative team pitching each other about what they thought they needed in a sequel Matrix game to recapture the magic, was funny both on its own, and as a meta-comment about this being a Matrix sequel 20 years after the orginal and no one could agree what made the first one so important).

The first move was enough of a game-changer that it could be dead earnest and work; the sequels dont have that luxury and I think that same earnestness kind of hurt them (amongst, like, a laundry list of other factors). This one was enjoyable to watch and didn't take itself nearly so seriously, and that really worked.
 

Drew

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Yessss, I hate that when they all just have generic british accents in period pieces.
"Make it foreign, but not TOO foreign."

All the bad guys are Nazis, all the good guys are British. And some of the Nazis are also British, but they sneer a lot more so you can tell them apart.
 

Electric Wizard

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(little things like the creative team pitching each other about what they thought they needed in a sequel Matrix game to recapture the magic, was funny both on its own, and as a meta-comment about this being a Matrix sequel 20 years after the orginal and no one could agree what made the first one so important).
Honestly this stuff is what killed it for me. I felt like the hollywood film industry meta narrative came at the expense of development of other story aspects. And because of that, Lana Wachowski's implication that WB would have churned out a cynical cash grab fell flat, because with not much to add to the story it was kind of just her own cynical cash grab. The hollywood critique would have been a great article or book but I thought it made the movie feel lazy (along with all the reused footage).
 

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Maybe I'm burned out from that "ironic" self-awareness from how over-done it already is in video games, but it really didn't land for me.

And I'm a tech-y kind of guy and I can watch any of the other Matrix movies without groaning over their treatment of technology, but new Matrix's take on tech and it's place in society reeks of "how did nobody working on this movie understand video games or technology past facebook-is-bad-for-you?" It feels like the script was written by someone who knows the kids these days like those video game things, right? And those are made by like, super hacker tech bros right? Computers, AI, the internet, etc., are all much better understood by the general public now than they ever were, but they still opted for that trope-y video game auteur genius hacker thing that is so implausible as to both take me out of the movie and almost feel like an insult to my intelligence. OG Matrix was at least plausible enough I could suspend some disbelief. This felt like a step back in that regard. "Totally gonna hackzorz the mainframe and tighten up the graphicks on level 3."

Sure, you can write that off in a bunch of ways. "It's the matrix, so it's world doesn't have to be believable, it's all fake anyway." "Not everyone knows how software is made." "Maybe this was supposed to be taken as some subtle in-joke poking fun at how people don't actually understand how these work, and you just, like, didn't get it. Woosh, bro." "The Matrix themselves pioneered some dumb tech tropes." Except that gamers aren't a niche anymore (which they are aware of, otherwise they wouldn't have jammed a game dev narrative into the movie, IMO). And the originals never did anything with tech that was clearly based on a misunderstanding of the source material - either it was plausible, or it was intentionally out there for thematic reasons - but it was never "just jam computer shit in there, cause our audience will never know the difference".
 

Rev2010

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It feels like the script was written by someone who knows the kids these days like those video game things, right? And those are made by like, super hacker tech bros right?

Just felt the need to set this straight as a professional IT Tech of over 22 years, someone that has done hacking, and someone that has done 3D modeling/animation (short stint at an actual game company too).... game designers/computer programmers are NOT hackers! Hackers are more computer security/security flaw experts that find and/or exploit vulnerabilities in computer software/hardware. Hacking takes a lot of time learning/testing/experimenting/executing. It's way more than a casual hobby, same goes for learning how to program, 3D model, 3D animate, etc. Most hackers know way more about networking than actual programming.

Point is simply that they are not one and the same
 

TedEH

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And that's just my point - game devs are abundant and available and usually more than willing to talk about it (like me, I'll take any opportunity to remind people that I'm a dev, have been for almost 10 years, and have worked on a bunch of stuff people have actually played) - so it would have been abundantly easy for them to consult with anyone who could tell them that their depiction is so far removed from how game design and development works that it's almost insulting. And that's even if you play loose with the semantics and let "hacker" mean anyone who makes heavy use of a computer. I can easily vouch that your average game dev type is not a security expert by any stretch.
 

Louis Cypher

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The BBC is super guilty of the whole woke tokenism shit, though they're doing it in a far worse way. I remember one show aimed at teaching kids about ancient Rome and how they affected Britain, where the majority of characters were black, which is just false. There were North African auxiliary legions/soldiers, but they weren't really in Britain from what the records show.

Your wrong about that actually. Try reading what Mary Beard (Professor of Classics at the University of Cambridge, fellow of Newnham College, and Royal Academy of Arts Professor of Ancient Literature) has to say about the ethnic diversity of Britian during the Roman occupation. Facts aren't woke tokenism

On topic. Glad this thread was created before I saw the film and wasted time and money on it
 

Drew

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Honestly this stuff is what killed it for me. I felt like the hollywood film industry meta narrative came at the expense of development of other story aspects. And because of that, Lana Wachowski's implication that WB would have churned out a cynical cash grab fell flat, because with not much to add to the story it was kind of just her own cynical cash grab. The hollywood critique would have been a great article or book but I thought it made the movie feel lazy (along with all the reused footage).
So, honest question, what's the alternative here?

The original Matrix was a movie about questioning the reality of subjective experience and everything you know being a lie, and introduced visual effects that, well, the movie storyline could have sucked and people STILL would have been talking about the Matrix today.

Where do you go from there? Imply that even that other reality isn't real, and invent bullettime 2.0? The latter they kinda did with Neil Patrick Harris walking around while verytone else was essentially frozen, I guess, but they had the good sense to make that pretty incidental and make the focus of those scenes about the dialogue.

In some ways, making a sequel for a movie like The Matrix is a trap. All the things that made it awesome were things that basically no one had ever seen or done before. If you try to do them again, but bigger and MORE serious... well, we all saw and promptly repressed 2 and 3. I honestly don't know what direction you go in a sequel without at least injecting some meta-humor so the movie's pretension doesn't become its undoing.

Legitimate question, btw, if you were directing this I'd love to know what you would have done differently.
 

IwantTacos

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So, honest question, what's the alternative here?

The original Matrix was a movie about questioning the reality of subjective experience and everything you know being a lie, and introduced visual effects that, well, the movie storyline could have sucked and people STILL would have been talking about the Matrix today.

Where do you go from there? Imply that even that other reality isn't real, and invent bullettime 2.0? The latter they kinda did with Neil Patrick Harris walking around while verytone else was essentially frozen, I guess, but they had the good sense to make that pretty incidental and make the focus of those scenes about the dialogue.

In some ways, making a sequel for a movie like The Matrix is a trap. All the things that made it awesome were things that basically no one had ever seen or done before. If you try to do them again, but bigger and MORE serious... well, we all saw and promptly repressed 2 and 3. I honestly don't know what direction you go in a sequel without at least injecting some meta-humor so the movie's pretension doesn't become its undoing.

Legitimate question, btw, if you were directing this I'd love to know what you would have done differently.

2 hours of the robot war.
 


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