Anyone watching the big game tonight?

[ArtDecade]

It is obvious that Trump and Navarro are not looking to reset trade agreements at this point. There are no deals completed and none in the works. This is about revenue generation - not trade.

 

[nightflameauto]

Speaking of dark money things, has this guy or others been getting traction on any of this?

Congressman Crow Introduces Bill to Fight Corruption, End Dark Money in Elections

WASHINGTON — Congressman Jason Crow (D-CO-06) has introduced new legislation to fight corruption and crack down on dark money influencing U.S. elections.

crow.house.gov

I expect him to get disappeared fairly soon. You don't try to take on corruption in this government. Certainly not out in the open like this.

But at the same time, I think judging the Democrats on their performance, on things they didn't have the votes to actually implement, is certainly challenging, you know?

I often get the impression when interacting with you that you have the stance that we're never supposed to judge the Democrats for anything they do, or manage to not do because they refuse to come together to fight when they have the opportunity. It's difficult for me to wrap my head around defending them this staunchly, when the only real accomplishment they can point to these days is, "We're not them, but we're kinda like them forty years ago."

 

[wankerness]

Seems like Trump and Navarro want to gut the market and re-establish the gold standard. Make America 1970 Again.

Ironically for that, Germany now wants to remove millions and millions of dollars worth of gold that they've been storing in the US.

So what’s their best case scenario here? 5 years from now companies start manufacturing in the US? Jobs that are mostly automated or are in the process of being automated? Or hey let’s say they hire people, and we’ve reached a new “good ol days”, except those jobs don’t pay enough to provide people the ability to live like they did in the 50s and 60s.

I can see it now from the GOP after their voters realize American made shit is expensive because you have to pay people: “Fast food Factory work is supposed to be a teen job, you can’t expect to make a living flipping burgers switches”

Trump is a complete moron and has made statements recently that suggest he earnestly believes that it will take "up to 2 years" for manufacturing to get started up here. The problem is that even excepting the fact that the only way manufacturing in the US would be profitable would be if they could find US workers that would work at the same rates as like, Vietnamese workers (average yearly income in Vietnam is something like 9000 while ours is like 66000), his same fucking tariffs have made it radically more difficult to BUILD THE FACTORY. He's just an idiot making it impossible to do what he's trying to do.

 

[wankerness]

It is obvious that Trump and Navarro are not looking to reset trade agreements at this point. There are no deals completed and none in the works. This is about revenue generation - not trade.

The problem is king dipshit here implemented them so badly they're not going to see profits. You don't make money from tariffs if no one's buying any imports cause they have no money.

 

[Metalman X]

Idiocracy was intended to be a comedy, not a blueprint.

I been saying this almost verbatim, since by the time covid came, and we bungled the response because suddenly doctors with degrees and education and experience must have no idea what their talking about.... lets listen to the bitter racist, failed businessman suggesting injecting bleach instead. Because sadly there needs to be a fairly large amount of stupidity listening to and enabling that level of stupidity to allow it to fail upwards to the degrees wee been seeing in the last decade or two.

I hate to sound like "old guy blaming social media", but for all the good it brings, I been noticing for awhile how it allows ideas and concepts with no basis in reality or common sense to spread and fast. I feel like there used to be a certain "common sense" filter that would limit these poisonous ideas to all but the most fringe conspiracy types. With 'slower' media, it would kinda' get slapped down, or just made the butt of some jokes. But nowadays, it just zips right past those social filters to ears all too eager to for easy answers, and "someone else" to blame. Don't really know how we can even put that genie back in the bottle aside from a sharp increase in earlier education regarding critical thinking, and media literacy. And in the US, even before the Education Dept. just got gutted, that was very unlikely to happen. Now that those who benefit the most from disinformation got a hold, ..... I dunno man, shits bleak.

 

[wiretap]

Ironically for that, Germany now wants to remove millions and millions of dollars worth of gold that they've been storing in the US.

Trump is a complete moron and has made statements recently that suggest he earnestly believes that it will take "up to 2 years" for manufacturing to get started up here. The problem is that even excepting the fact that the only way manufacturing in the US would be profitable would be if they could find US workers that would work at the same rates as like, Vietnamese workers (average yearly income in Vietnam is something like 9000 while ours is like 66000), his same fucking tariffs have made it radically more difficult to BUILD THE FACTORY. He's just an idiot making it impossible to do what he's trying to do.

Oh I know that, I was being a smartass more than anything else. Trump is a dumbass and his ideas are that of a dumbass. I ignored his two year comment he made because let’s be honest, that was just bullshit to try and prep for midterms.

 

[Metalman X]

So what’s their best case scenario here? 5 years from now companies start manufacturing in the US? Jobs that are mostly automated or are in the process of being automated? Or hey let’s say they hire people, and we’ve reached a new “good ol days”, except those jobs don’t pay enough to provide people the ability to live like they did in the 50s and 60s.

I can see it now from the GOP after their voters realize American made shit is expensive because you have to pay people: “Fast food Factory work is supposed to be a teen job, you can’t expect to make a living flipping burgers switches”

Exactly, 100% this.

Tangerine Mussolini's tariff "idea" is at best, based on like, maybe a 1950's world economy. Too dumb and out of touch to realize the world cannot and will not revert progress just because he throws and tantrum and shits his McDaiper hard enough.

Mostly its just dumb AF, and most the world knows it. And i don't think the motivations behind it are what the grinch wants us to believe anyway. The ploy of tanking the markets and buying and consolidating wealth to the even smaller wealthier few is the SATAM-cartoon villain point, and is so blatantly obvious its infuriating it's being allowed to happen at all. But we allowed a system that enables this fuckery. Perhaps one of the only "truths" the asshole recently told is "its a great time to get rich" ....indeed, at everyone else's expense.

 

[kamello]

as a non-resident of the US

fuck you all guys

 

[Randy]

Seems beyond his comprehension, but has anybody floated that the last couple times we were heavy on manufacturing came on the coattails of a major military conflict and perhaps the goal is to provoke one?

 

[tedtan]

Lmao a fake Twitter account was spreading a fake rumor about the admin doing a 90 day pause on China tariffs and that actually fucking caused the stock market to briefly stop hemorrhaging

All because of a bullshit tweet

The market is just a reflection of investors’ confidence, and they want it to go up, so any reason can cause a short blip up or down. Unfortunately, these stupid tariffs are still driving confidence, and the market as a whole, down.

Musk out billionaires Soros by 55x, you'd think he could pull off superior turnouts in his schemes especially with how public he is vs. all the alleged cloak and dagger with Soros

But cloak and dagger makes for better conspiracy theories.

I'm not even going to try to catch up on the last 20 or so pages, for now I just want to continue to reiterate that this is the stupidest recession ever.

Guess Trump won so much he got tired of winning.

That or he’s truly an idiot.

The courts have set a deadline for the return of the Maryland man mistakenly sent to El Salvador. The Trump administration is not arguing that the man was sent there in error. They are arguing that the Courts cannot force the Executive Branch to engage in foreign diplomacy and that by doing so would set a terrible precedent. One the one hand, Trump does not give two shits about the division of power and does whatever he wants. The simple fact is the courts became involved because he showed no interest in bringing the man back. On the other hand, I do not believe there has been a situation where a standing president can be ordered to engage with a foreign power. This is a strange one.

This is more of a “fix your fuckup” than a direct “engage in foreign diplomacy order”.

Idiocracy was intended to be a comedy, not a blueprint.

If only the idiots were capable of realizing this.

Well, yes, I'd be taking a loss compared to a week ago. The concern here isn't "am I taking a loss now" it's "if I need cash in the next four years will I be taking a bigger loss now or then." It's sorta looking like signs point to "if you need cash during the Trump presidency, the time to sell was the last three months. The second best time is now cause we're nowhere close to the bottom."

As I stated, if you don’t need money short term, selling now is a bad move IMO; panic selling almost never works out well.

If you need money short term, maybe taking the loss is your best option. And you may even come out ahead by taking money out now in some cases, like to buy a house, because a recession will probably drive home prices down, too, unless you’re in a really in demand market.

But unless you actually need the money (e.g., for emergency surgery or something of that importance and urgency), it’s generally best to hold rather than a to sell at this point.

 

[nightflameauto]

Seems beyond his comprehension, but has anybody floated that the last couple times we were heavy on manufacturing came on the coattails of a major military conflict and perhaps the goal is to provoke one?

I've wondered if this isn't ultimately the direction we've been headed for a while anyway. And if Trump's handlers aren't letting this all go down to keep people beaten down enough to jump aboard the slave wages necessary to really get manufacturing rolling again in the US. War could play a vital part is making that happen. "Be a true patriot! Defend America by suffering for the cause."

Gonna be a little bit of a problem that a large chunk of the American public feels so little pride in the overall country right now. Hard to feel patriotic when you feel the country is bleeding the population dry in order to feed the already extremely wealthy.

 

[ArtDecade]

Trump is a special form of stupid. Once he obliterates the markets and realizes he didn't get what he wanted, he will deduce the only way to reset the economy is war production.

Seems beyond his comprehension, but has anybody floated that the last couple times we were heavy on manufacturing came on the coattails of a major military conflict and perhaps the goal is to provoke one?

Yup - I floated that idea back on page 255 (#5081).

 

[Randy]

I've wondered if this isn't ultimately the direction we've been headed for a while anyway. And if Trump's handlers aren't letting this all go down to keep people beaten down enough to jump aboard the slave wages necessary to really get manufacturing rolling again in the US. War could play a vital part is making that happen. "Be a true patriot! Defend America by suffering for the cause."

Gonna be a little bit of a problem that a large chunk of the American public feels so little pride in the overall country right now. Hard to feel patriotic when you feel the country is bleeding the population dry in order to feed the already extremely wealthy.

Greenlighting the "Riviera-fication" of Gaza and swatting the hornets nest against the Houthis feels like provocation, for sure. He's got whatever weird backroom deal with Russia that seems poised to let him take Ukraine, maybe Estonia or elsewhere next and ultimately no buffer between Russia and the entire eastern front of NATO.

Again, if you take them as anything more than the rantings of a mad man, you look at his new fixation on Canada and Greenland as a "national security asset" like he's expecting missiles to come flying over the border at any time.

Dunno if he's got the stomach to do it, but the isolationist schtick, the colonialism, etc. The only glue that would hold all those positions together would be a widescale military conflict.

 

[slim231990]

I hate to sound like "old guy blaming social media", but for all the good it brings, I been noticing for awhile how it allows ideas and concepts with no basis in reality or common sense to spread and fast.

This is the real head of the snake right here. I keep coming back to the same conclusion that if social media wasn't used as a tool to brainwash the average American we wouldn't be on this timeline lol.
What's really scary is that the average person gets ALL their info from SM, and when the wealthy elite are using a super powerful algorithm to herd the masses means we're going to be dealing with this shit for a long time.

Boomers always tell me "well they've always brainwashed people with the TV/Radio", and I'm like "yea there's a big difference". People could go days without watching TV or listening to the radio, but now the average person can't go more than 5 minutes without checking their phone.

As a 90's kid I've seen the world pre and post social media, and it was much better without it.

 

[nightflameauto]

Greenlighting the "Riviera-fication" of Gaza and swatting the hornets nest against the Houthis feels like provocation, for sure. He's got whatever weird backroom deal with Russia that seems poised to let him take Ukraine, maybe Estonia or elsewhere next and ultimately no buffer between Russia and the entire eastern front of NATO.

Again, if you take them as anything more than the rantings of a mad man, you look at his new fixation on Canada and Greenland as a "national security asset" like he's expecting missiles to come flying over the border at any time.

Dunno if he's got the stomach to do it, but the isolationist schtick, the colonialism, etc. The only glue that would hold all those positions together would be a widescale military conflict.

All his paranoia about the whole world being out to get us is believed by enough of his followers to make war a sadly available option in the next few months/years.

Per @slim231990 's point, there's a legitimate argument to be made that the algorithm got Trump elected the first time around accidentally. Outrage and anger drive clicks, and the algorithms are designed specifically to keep people engaged. What's more outrageous and anger inducing than Trump rhetoric? Not much.

By this go-round, it was likely on purpose, but I think Trump's first Presidency could very well have been an accident by the current broligarchy. They studied it, refined it, and now intentionally drive it the same direction because they know how to steer it the direction they want it to go. I just hope we wake up from that driving before they find a more intelligent and articulate puppet that drives the same engagement.

 

[Metalman X]

This is the real head of the snake right here. I keep coming back to the same conclusion that if social media wasn't used as a tool to brainwash the average American we wouldn't be on this timeline lol.
What's really scary is that the average person gets ALL their info from SM, and when the wealthy elite are using a super powerful algorithm to herd the masses means we're going to be dealing with this shit for a long time.

Boomers always tell me "well they've always brainwashed people with the TV/Radio", and I'm like "yea there's a big difference". People could go days without watching TV or listening to the radio, but now the average person can't go more than 5 minutes without checking their phone.

As a 90's kid I've seen the world pre and post social media, and it was much better without it.

The advent of mass social media is honestly a lot like splitting the atom (after all, information is a potent form of power in its own right). We can do a LOT of really cool, wonderful, and civilization advancing shit with this tech. But we as a species just haven't matured enough to where we won't immediately weaponize our achievements first chance we get. We could be likely have been colonizing Mars and beyond right now, seeing and learning, and making some amazing stuff.... but we'd rather point fingers and warheads at each other instead. (Anybody else here seen 'For All Mankind'? That speculates the kinda' AU the Cold War, and continued mass conflict and division robbed us of.

 

[Drew]

I expect him to get disappeared fairly soon. You don't try to take on corruption in this government. Certainly not out in the open like this.

I often get the impression when interacting with you that you have the stance that we're never supposed to judge the Democrats for anything they do, or manage to not do because they refuse to come together to fight when they have the opportunity. It's difficult for me to wrap my head around defending them this staunchly, when the only real accomplishment they can point to these days is, "We're not them, but we're kinda like them forty years ago."

I think it's more about recognizing the constraints you're working under, and judging outcomes based on a realistic assessment of what they COULD have done. I do think the ACA was a missed opportunity, but at the same time, if you needed Lieberman to get to a veto-proof majority, how realistic was it to expect the Democrats to pass their ideal, aspirational bill? I wanted more too, I just don't think we'd get it. tl;dr - I think we need to be realistic in setting goalposts.

Meanwhile, I'm still surprised and impressed Biden got both the CHIPS Act and the Inflation Reducton Act/stealth green energy bill, as well as a major bipartisan infrastructure bill done, despite having narrow majorities. Yeah, even there I wanted more too... but the fact we got as much done as we did is impressive.

 

[Drew]

as a non-resident of the US

fuck you all guys

Yeah, sorry about, well, everything. We have it too.

 

[JSanta]

Gonna toss out a suggested read for all of you. It's called Everybody Lies, and I think demonstrated the hateful direction this country has gone down is not a fluke. There are significant pockets of extremely hateful people, and in what was once declared a "post-racial" society when Obama was elected really drove home the point that many people are just awful.

A couple of things he found using these massive data sets (did run through examples using ChatGPT for the quick synopsis):

• Geographic Distribution of Racist Searches: Beyond the Deep South, regions such as upstate New York, western Pennsylvania, and eastern Ohio also exhibited high rates of racist search queries. This finding challenges the assumption that racial animus is predominantly confined to certain geographic areas.
• Correlation with Voting Behavior: The prevalence of racist searches in specific areas corresponded with Obama's reduced performance in those regions during the election. This suggests that despite public assertions of a post-racial society, underlying racial biases influenced voting patterns.
• Persistence of Racism Post-Obama's Election: Even after Obama's 2008 victory, racist search activity remained high, indicating that the election did not signify the end of racial prejudices. This underscores the discrepancy between public affirmations of racial progress and the continued existence of racist sentiments.

The author also spent a lot of time using Pornhub data, and that unsurprisingly sheds an interesting light on typical conservative areas.

Anyway, great book. highly recommend. https://sethsd.com/everybodylies

 

[nightflameauto]

I think it's more about recognizing the constraints you're working under, and judging outcomes based on a realistic assessment of what they COULD have done. I do think the ACA was a missed opportunity, but at the same time, if you needed Lieberman to get to a veto-proof majority, how realistic was it to expect the Democrats to pass their ideal, aspirational bill? I wanted more too, I just don't think we'd get it. tl;dr - I think we need to be realistic in setting goalposts.

I would argue that a systemic situation where the Democrats never even try to fight to get in a position to do anything for this length of time says there's a fundamental problem with the party itself. Looking at goalposts that they seem to intentionally run away screaming from as if afraid of approaching doesn't change the fact that they come off like absolute cowards.

Meanwhile, I'm still surprised and impressed Biden got both the CHIPS Act and the Inflation Reducton Act/stealth green energy bill, as well as a major bipartisan infrastructure bill done, despite having narrow majorities. Yeah, even there I wanted more too... but the fact we got as much done as we did is impressive.

The CHiPs act to me is the Democrats fully adopting the Republican ideals of yesteryear. Only by handing billions to already profitable business can we have a positive future? That's a win? Handing money to big business is always palatable to our government. Blank checks for promises and daydreams are easy to push through.

It's very much like the billions we've handed to telecom to never complete a broadband project.

Inflation Reduction I'll grant had some merit, and I'm honestly shocked it didn't blow up in the womb simply because it would have started addressing some of the infrastructure issues we've been suffering with over the past couple decades.

Despite what I'm saying here, I still think Biden actually tried to do what was right by the country. I disagreed with a lot of how he went about it, and think we need to get past the idea that trickle-down is gonna save us and that only shoveling taxpayer funds at big business can do any good all for us, but at least the man was trying. I'd still rather have someone with his mentality in the office than what we have today.

I just think that our current two political parties come off to the general public like, "Fight like hell for the worst possible outcome (Republican), or don't fight at all because in reality, we're fine with the status quo (Democrat)." And some of us would like to see a true alternative to the status quo, or rushing headlong toward far worse.

EDIT: I think SSO needs to start looking at their codebase. This "refocus off the edit window every time the ads auto-refresh" thing is really getting aggravating to type through.