Any Brits here?

thraxil

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Ugh.

I'm due for UK naturalization this year. Part of that is an obnoxious, anachronistic ceremony where I have to swear allegiance to the reigning monarch. I'm pretty opposed to the basic concept of monarchy (I'm from New England, we're still a bit salty about the Revolutionary War) but I've got to effectively hold my nose and do it at some point.

Elizabeth at leasts seemed respectable.

Now, I'm going to have to swear allegiance to... Charles...

I guess beginning my life as an official Brit with disappointment is pretty much The British Way.
 

StevenC

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Upon hearing the news my dad told me "seems the soap opera has ended for a lot of people." My answer was "No, now is when it gets good."
With the unholy trinity of Truss, Coffey and Charles, the NHS will exclusively offer homeopathic treatment by the end of the year.
 

bostjan

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Ugh.

I'm due for UK naturalization this year. Part of that is an obnoxious, anachronistic ceremony where I have to swear allegiance to the reigning monarch. I'm pretty opposed to the basic concept of monarchy (I'm from New England, we're still a bit salty about the Revolutionary War) but I've got to effectively hold my nose and do it at some point.

Elizabeth at leasts seemed respectable.

Now, I'm going to have to swear allegiance to... Charles...

I guess beginning my life as an official Brit with disappointment is pretty much The British Way.
Is it possible to swear allegiance to a former monarch? Maybe Richard I or King Æðelstān?
 

thraxil

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Is it possible to swear allegiance to a former monarch? Maybe Richard I or King Æðelstān?
Specifically, I will (or would have before today) have to recite: "I (name) do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that on becoming a British Citizen, I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, her Heirs and Successors, according to law"

When talking about all of Great Britain, yes. If you're specifically speaking of England, "hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way"

The time is gone, the song is over.

Technically though, while I will legally be British, I will never be English.
 

Alberto7

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With the unholy trinity of Truss, Coffey and Charles, the NHS will exclusively offer homeopathic treatment by the end of the year.
Fucken' yikes. I wonder what kind of influence Charles will have on politics in this day and age.

Specifically, I will (or would have before today) have to recite: "I (name) do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that on becoming a British Citizen, I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, her Heirs and Successors, according to law"



The time is gone, the song is over.

Technically though, while I will legally be British, I will never be English.
I had to do the same thing when I got my Canadian citizenship a few years ago. It was weird.

... I also had to do that when I obtained my Spanish citizenship at age 10 or 11 :lol:
 

Drew

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Ugh.

I'm due for UK naturalization this year. Part of that is an obnoxious, anachronistic ceremony where I have to swear allegiance to the reigning monarch. I'm pretty opposed to the basic concept of monarchy (I'm from New England, we're still a bit salty about the Revolutionary War) but I've got to effectively hold my nose and do it at some point.

Elizabeth at leasts seemed respectable.

Now, I'm going to have to swear allegiance to... Charles...

I guess beginning my life as an official Brit with disappointment is pretty much The British Way.
Can you swear to the crown, rather than the man?

But, think of the bright side - we won that war. Your swearing alliance to either the King or the Crown is a choice you're making, rather than something that's required of you by virtue of where you're born. Freedom is the freedom to spend that freedom however you choose.
 

thraxil

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Can you swear to the crown, rather than the man?

I mean, I can swear allegiance to anything I want, but I suspect that not repeating the exact oath that they tell you to repeat (and that's already the non religious version; they have a variant with some God stuff in there if that's more your style--also, you have the option to do the ceremony in Welsh but I would like to keep most of my saliva in my mouth, thankyouverymuch) will just result in them not giving me citizenship. It's treated kind of like swearing someone in for office or to testify in court.

But, think of the bright side - we won that war. Your swearing alliance to either the King or the Crown is a choice you're making, rather than something that's required of you by virtue of where you're born. Freedom is the freedom to spend that freedom however you choose.

Yeah. Growing up as an athiest and having to recite the Pledge of Allegiance every morning in school, it's really no worse. It's just that the words "King Charles the Third" are going to be a bit rougher going down.
 

Drew

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Fucken' yikes. I wonder what kind of influence Charles will have on politics in this day and age.
Charles is in the news today for saying he doesn't plan to get involved in politics, in his first address to Parliament, which is almost certainly for the best. I have higher hopes for the kids.
 

StevenC

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Charles is in the news today for saying he doesn't plan to get involved in politics, in his first address to Parliament, which is almost certainly for the best. I have higher hopes for the kids.
We'll see. He's been meddling his whole life.
 

Louis Cypher

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This mini budget was all the right wing think tanks absolutest wet dream... absolutely shocking nakedly brazen budget to ensure the wealthy get wealthier. None of it will help with the cost of living or inflation, will make it worse. The Bank of England apparently will have no choice butbto up interest rates even higher because of these tax cuts. The worst part on top of all that for the wealthy is the fact that the poorest those on Universal Credit are gonna be hit with benefit cuts!

Response to it from the markets was for the pound to tank to a 37 yr low against the $ and €
 
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Louis Cypher

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Daming interview of the mini budget from Danny Blanchflower, a former member of a Bank of England committee

IMF critical of the mini budget and what its done, £ tanking to record lows, house prices to drop by 10%, signifcant interest rate rises, inflation due to rise even higher than the 12% it is now, banks pulling mortgage deals off the market, White House critical of the way the Truss' goverment is doing things, worlds biggest hedge fund ceo is describing the mini budget, "Mechanistically, the UK government is operating like the government of an emerging country - it is producing too much debt in a currency that there is not a big world demand for." plus loads more I could list and yet, Brexiteer nut jobs wankers like John Redwood and former Brexit Minister "Lord" - I signed up to a BS pathetic brexit deal just to get it done and then within weeks disowned it and quit because I am so useless - Frost are all saying the Gov needs to stand firm and not bow down(??) and the usual Murdoch payroll commentators like Carole Malone, who is on TV today defending it all, and twats from TalkTV defending it all and blaming anyone or thing other than Truss and Kwarteng in the face of all thats happening right in the last few days since the mini budget announcement, inc blaming the economic policies of Boris and Sunak as being so bad something drastic needed doing - coz of course those policies were all of what? 4 months ago?!?!

The real sense of how bad it all really is, is that the Mail & Express today, after 4 days of front pages defending it all have both today got front pages that completely ignore the whole thing and talk about how how one of Stephen Lawrence's killers has a phone in prison (mail) and how there are warnings of a covid/flu epidemic this winter, so get your jabs (Express). If the Mail and Express feel that they cannot defend whats going and need to post some diversionary tactics then things really are fcuking bad!! Tbh I am surprised Megan and Harry weren't on the front page! Best is that both Truss and Kwarteng are both hiding from the press and public, though Kwarteng is apprently going to get banks on side with his budget by promising record deregulation of the sector.... exactly what is needed to help all those who are deciding between eating and heating and are poss going to lose their homes due to mortgages they can no longer afford on top of doubled energy prices even with the new cap and rising living costs

What we need is electoral reform, we need some form of Proportional Representation in UK politics. Tory's don't want it as they will never ever be in power again under PR, so why on earth Starmer is ignoring the calls for reform is beyond me, 2 party/1st past the post is dead. The Brexit Goverments in pariticular this extremist right wing gov under Truss and her cronies is proof that the BS that 1stPtP keeps extremist parties out of governing is nothing but Tory gaslighting to maintain power
 
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Louis Cypher

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Opinions on the IMF statre from some lunatics.

Andrew Lilico Telegragh columist says in a tweet: "Embarrassed for the IMF. This is the IMF self-declaring as a left-wing body. The UK should now without its IMF contributions" LOL!!

Lord Frost: "The IMF has consistently advocated highly conventional economic policies. It is following this approach that has produced years of slow growth and weak productivity. The only way forward for Britain is lower taxes, spending restraint, and significant economic reform."

Lord Daniel Hannan: "No, the pound isn’t crashing over a trifling batch of tax cuts. It’s because the markets are terrified of Starmer"

Crispin Odie billionaire hedge fund tycoon who apparently made a fortune in the last few days out of the £ tanking: "Remainers (in the City) who hate the Goverment.... are to blame for the run on the pound..... "
 

Drew

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So, you brits just had your fx and sovereign markets get REAL interesting, real fast.

tl;dr for those of you who aren't in England, or don't follow this stuff:

*Inflation in England is, as in much of the world, high, with demand significantly outstripping supply.
*The BOE is hiking short term rates, something that's supposed to provide monetary tightening by making it more expensive to borrow, to respond to high inflation.
*The incoming British government releases a budget thats all fiscal stimulus, notably with significant tax cuts. Fiscal stimulus puts more money in tax payers' pockets, allowing them to spend more, boosting demand.
*This is a problem - see point 1. The government and BOE are working at cross purposes.
*Markets also see this is a problem. The pound tanked, as @Louis Cypher notes... but yields on UK sovereign bonds also surged.
*a weakening currency and surging yields are something you normally don't see in developed market currencies, only in emerging market ones. This is because higher sovereign yields usually attract buyers, which strengthens the currency. When the currency weakens and yields rise, that usually means the market expects runaway inflation, sovereign default, or both.

Here's where things get fun:
*As higher yields lead t bond price losses, and as the stock market was freaking the fuck out at this time too, lots of investors lost money. Notably, a number of large UK pension funds lost money, and a good number of them were engaging in liability driven investment strategies, matching bond maturities to known liability needs, with leverage, to allow them to hedge liabilities. When these funds lost money in abnormal and unexpected ways - because no one expects the pound to behave like an emerging markets currency - they suddenly found themselves facing large margin calls. To raise funds to meet these margin calls in a challenging market, they had to sell whatever had the best liquidity, which means sovereign bonds (and, with liability-hedging strategies, you usually want extremely low risk bonds anyway, which until this week these were).
*A whole bunch of people selling sovereign bonds at once also causes prices to fall and yields to rise, leading to further losses in pension funds, and further margin calls.
*faced with the prospect of a death spiral, the BOE stepped in and started buying U sovereigns, to help stabilize their prices and stop yields from spiraling out of control.
*while this worked, and yelds are falling today... normally we call bond buying by a central bank "quantitative easing," and it's a form of providing added stimulus to an economy. This time last week the BOE was talking about their plans to begin quantitative tightening in response to high inflation, and throwing even MORE money into the monetary supply isn't going to help the inflation picture or weakness in sterling one bit.

I have my own thoughts on the efficacy of tax cuts vs other forms of stimuus spending, but that's neither here nor there - the Truss government badly needs to blink here, and back away from tax cuts and other forms of fiscal stimulus, or they're going to risk blowing up the pound.

Like, more than it already has.
 


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