Nintendo Switch 2

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wankerness

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Yeah but like that's assuming Xbox doesn't do away with their store and change to a new system.

Meanwhile Nintendo has just said everything you downloaded on Switch 1 will run on Switch 2, and it's the same shop.

I understand the sentiment, but your Xbox games are no safer. For now Switch games will last as long as Switch 2 at least, and we assume that they will continue that way as long as Nintendo is releasing hardware. Which is what we're also doing with Xbox and Sony.

My, maybe slightly homerist, opinion is that Nintendo has been really opposed to games as a service forever and they've been making these small concessions going forward. Cloud storage is a first for them last gen; migrating data to your new console is a first this gen, as is maintaining the same store and interface.
I'm just going on past history. Xbox has yet to do any kind of reset - all your stuff still shows up if you log into your account. It's been 19 years now. AFAIK PS has not done a reset, but they have pulled a Nintendo and locked some games to previous systems (ex the PSP/Vita/PSTV, etc). But, if you bought PS3 digital games, they're still logged on your account, and when they occasionally release PS2 games (Ex Legend of Dragoon) on PS4, you got them for free if you'd bought them many years ago. Not great, but vastly better than Nintendo's system of "yeah, sure, you bought Virtual Console games back on Wii/Wii-U/3DS, and many of the same games are on switch now, but the past purchases don't count and you can't buy them now either, they're all locked behind a subscription!"

Nintendo, on the other hand, had a digital storefront on wii. Then on Wii-U, they released many of the same games in a new wii-u storefront (ex there were two different releases of Majora's Mask the N64 version, with different performance/subtley different graphics, which were entirely separate purchases). Wii-U like, had a Wii EMULATOR, so you could still play stuff you bought in the Wii storefront, but it was weird and coexisted with the new storefront. Then they wiped that out entirely and now all that stuff is gone, and they even wiped the associated accounts, so for all intents and purposes none of that ever happened - if you downloaded it, it's on your system till it dies, and you're not getting it back if you get a new system. Parallel to this was the 3DS, which was the same deal. They just keep changing account types and resetting storefronts and wiping out purchase history. We've never seen a Nintendo storefront/purchase history last more than two consecutive systems, nor any of their digital games get carried across more than one console generation.

Basically just going on past history nintendo has inspired zero trust on honoring past purchases, PS isn't great but at least hasn't wiped out records, and xbox has inspired quite a bit. And Steam, GOG, on PC are even better. You can still download and play (albeit with manual patches for some really outdated stuff) anything you bought more than 20 years ago, even stuff the publishers yanked from the storefronts. Nintendo is the worst by far. I'm glad they're carrying over Switch accounts but I will not be surprised at all if there are fees for upgrades and if next generation they end up wiping everything out (unless they carry on with "SWITCH 3" which I hope they do).

I also hate their implementation of cloud saves cause they're only available for some games. I don't get how the decision is made. All first party games work AFAIK but many others don't. I pay for the service primarily for animal crossing since losing that would RUIN my girlfriend!

--

Also, Nintendo has announced a bunch of their games will get free performance patches. The only thing that will cost money is when there is new content. I find this reasonable for Kirby and Mario Party, but really hoping they don't screw us and lock the Zelda patches behind the map app.
It's good they're releasing free performance patches for other games. It's just, from what I have seen online, BOTW and TOTK are the two that people complain about performance most often on (yes, other games have much worse performance, but I don't think there's a big audience for like, better-running Pokemon games since most HARDCORE GAMERS disregard those anyway), and Nintendo is probably aware of that and thus of course are going to look for any possible excuse to charge money for them. If they release a performance patch and make ONLY the stupid map tied to a purchase, or add some SUBSTANTIAL dlc, then I withdraw criticism, but I don't see either happening.
 

lattjeful

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Watching the gameplay footage they’re putting out now. The games look great!

Also wonder how old the footage in the Direct was. All of the games look noticeably better. First party and third party.
 

narad

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I don't remember, maybe they do. But they've been allowing that content on their platforms for a long time. Nintendo hasn't been "for kids" for a long time.

Guess that explains Super Futanari World
 

wankerness

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Watching the gameplay footage they’re putting out now. The games look great!

Also wonder how old the footage in the Direct was. All of the games look noticeably better. First party and third party.
The one thing with the gameplay footage I didn't like was Donkey Kong's new design. Why does he look so insane? What kind of redesign was that?! "Squish the top of his head inwards to accentuate the bug eyes and give him a crazed grin like the joker!" Maybe it will turn out it's a new character called Krazy Kong or something.
 

Alberto7

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Donkey Kong's new design is weird af, but the game looks great and looks super fun as well. Will definitely be playing that.

Also, Metroid Prime 4, hello? Shit looks so fucking good. That first boss battle did look kinda annoying. Classic Metroid Prime though.
 
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wankerness

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Yeah, that game looks like the dream Donkey Kong game. I am not a fan of what little i've played of the post-SNES sidescrollers, and DK64 was an incredibly tedious and miserable experience as soon as you start getting into it. Odyssey is GREAT. I just hope they keep the Rare designs in it, characters like Diddy and Cranky are iconic. I think Cranky was shown, but that's it so far I think.
 

BlackMastodon

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Gonna catch up on this thread anyway but yeah, no:

9pmhw7.jpg
 

StevenC

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I'm just going on past history. Xbox has yet to do any kind of reset - all your stuff still shows up if you log into your account. It's been 19 years now. AFAIK PS has not done a reset, but they have pulled a Nintendo and locked some games to previous systems (ex the PSP/Vita/PSTV, etc). But, if you bought PS3 digital games, they're still logged on your account, and when they occasionally release PS2 games (Ex Legend of Dragoon) on PS4, you got them for free if you'd bought them many years ago. Not great, but vastly better than Nintendo's system of "yeah, sure, you bought Virtual Console games back on Wii/Wii-U/3DS, and many of the same games are on switch now, but the past purchases don't count and you can't buy them now either, they're all locked behind a subscription!"

Nintendo, on the other hand, had a digital storefront on wii. Then on Wii-U, they released many of the same games in a new wii-u storefront (ex there were two different releases of Majora's Mask the N64 version, with different performance/subtley different graphics, which were entirely separate purchases). Wii-U like, had a Wii EMULATOR, so you could still play stuff you bought in the Wii storefront, but it was weird and coexisted with the new storefront. Then they wiped that out entirely and now all that stuff is gone, and they even wiped the associated accounts, so for all intents and purposes none of that ever happened - if you downloaded it, it's on your system till it dies, and you're not getting it back if you get a new system. Parallel to this was the 3DS, which was the same deal. They just keep changing account types and resetting storefronts and wiping out purchase history. We've never seen a Nintendo storefront/purchase history last more than two consecutive systems, nor any of their digital games get carried across more than one console generation.

Basically just going on past history nintendo has inspired zero trust on honoring past purchases, PS isn't great but at least hasn't wiped out records, and xbox has inspired quite a bit. And Steam, GOG, on PC are even better. You can still download and play (albeit with manual patches for some really outdated stuff) anything you bought more than 20 years ago, even stuff the publishers yanked from the storefronts. Nintendo is the worst by far. I'm glad they're carrying over Switch accounts but I will not be surprised at all if there are fees for upgrades and if next generation they end up wiping everything out (unless they carry on with "SWITCH 3" which I hope they do).

I also hate their implementation of cloud saves cause they're only available for some games. I don't get how the decision is made. All first party games work AFAIK but many others don't. I pay for the service primarily for animal crossing since losing that would RUIN my girlfriend!


It's good they're releasing free performance patches for other games. It's just, from what I have seen online, BOTW and TOTK are the two that people complain about performance most often on (yes, other games have much worse performance, but I don't think there's a big audience for like, better-running Pokemon games since most HARDCORE GAMERS disregard those anyway), and Nintendo is probably aware of that and thus of course are going to look for any possible excuse to charge money for them. If they release a performance patch and make ONLY the stupid map tied to a purchase, or add some SUBSTANTIAL dlc, then I withdraw criticism, but I don't see either happening.
Yes, ok but if you engage with my point, this is the first time Nintendo has had consistency between consoles like this. Consistency which Xbox has had since the 360. Consistency which Sony has had since the PS4.

In fact, Sony removed a game from existence a few months ago. There is no track record worse than that.
 

p0ke

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I'm considering pre-ordering one so I'd get to play at least some of the Nintendo exclusives I've missed (my previous console of theirs was the N64), but I really just wish they'd make a cheaper version of it without the handheld features.

The previous generation had exactly the opposite "lite" version, so I'm not exactly holding my breath for one...
 
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Crungy

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Nintendo's biggest transgression (to me personally) was never reviving Excitebike World Rally/Challenge with online play.

I love Mario Kart but EBWR was the shit. I'm sure I could find it and re-live the glory days aside from the lack of online play.
 

wankerness

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Yes, ok but if you engage with my point, this is the first time Nintendo has had consistency between consoles like this. Consistency which Xbox has had since the 360. Consistency which Sony has had since the PS4.
Okay, I agree that this is a good start. I just was arguing against your idea that we should trust Nintendo and shouldn't trust others since SO FAR it has been Nintendo being the worst. I guess they're usually behind with this kind of thing (I think they just kind of rejected the idea of mass online play for a while and grudgingly have added it) so maybe they'll just copy the other guys going forward, which I think is ideal. Even though I agree with them that there's way too much emphasis on online play and I would much, much rather play games like Mario Kart/Smash Bros with local multiplayer.
In fact, Sony removed a game from existence a few months ago. There is no track record worse than that.
If you're talking about Concord they did the world a favor.
 

TedEH

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So many things have gotten boosted in price in the last while, I feel like this kind of outrage towards inflation could be directed at something more meaningful than video games. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ They're luxury products that are expensive and difficult to make and maintain, with a boatload of free and cheap alternatives. Sure, I'm probably biased by my work, but this isn't some kind of special industry greed that needs to be punished, it's just normal inflation, like everything else is experiencing.
 

lattjeful

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So many things have gotten boosted in price in the last while, I feel like this kind of outrage towards inflation could be directed at something more meaningful than video games. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ They're luxury products that are expensive and difficult to make and maintain, with a boatload of free and cheap alternatives. Sure, I'm probably biased by my work, but this isn't some kind of special industry greed that needs to be punished, it's just normal inflation, like everything else is experiencing.
Meh, I'll take anything. If $80 Mario Kart is what gets people to realize how they're being fucked with, I'll take it.
 

lattjeful

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As an aside it seems like the gap between docked and handheld might be wider this time. Square Enix posted a blog post about FF7 Remake Intergrade and noted that docked would have "enhanced graphics and better textures." If I had to guess, docked mode is pushed harder to make the system act and perform more like a home console.

The game looks stellar, though it also did on PS4 as well. Direct screenshots from the Switch 2 version. Looks like it retains the PS5 visual features, but runs at a lower resolution:
1743702520784.jpeg

1743702533648.jpeg

1743702544909.jpeg

1743702605561.jpeg
1743702641020.jpeg
 

Grindspine

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Yes, ok but if you engage with my point, this is the first time Nintendo has had consistency between consoles like this. Consistency which Xbox has had since the 360. Consistency which Sony has had since the PS4.

In fact, Sony removed a game from existence a few months ago. There is no track record worse than that.
It reminds me of the transition from the DS to the DS lite to the 3DS. The 3DS was technically a new console that could play things that the DS could not, yet it was compatible with DS games.

The transition did nix the backwards compatibility that the DS and DS lite had with the GameBoy Advance though.
 

brector

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I don't mean to ask this question as a challenge to the above post, and I don't disagree...just trying to flesh out some context: the "OG" home consoles were sold for profit on their own. Even if you bought zero games, Nintendo, Sega, Atari, etc all made money on that singular purchase.

At some point, it became the norm for game consoles to be sold at a loss. I'm not sure if it started with the X-Box, but at least at launch, console companies lost money on the consoles with the intent of getting them into the hands of as many people as possible, to buy the software, to finally start making profits.

Is that the same scenario today?
I am not sure when it changed. I know Sony is making money on both the PS5 and the Pro. I would *assume* xbox is now as well.

But yes, they all used to sell the consoles at a loss and would make up the difference selling software
 

Alberto7

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As an aside it seems like the gap between docked and handheld might be wider this time. Square Enix posted a blog post about FF7 Remake Intergrade and noted that docked would have "enhanced graphics and better textures." If I had to guess, docked mode is pushed harder to make the system act and perform more like a home console.

The game looks stellar, though it also did on PS4 as well. Direct screenshots from the Switch 2 version. Looks like it retains the PS5 visual features, but runs at a lower resolution:
View attachment 160646
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View attachment 160649View attachment 160650
I could very well be wrong, but it's likely the performance is just capped when in handheld mode? The dock has a fan this time around, so better cooling could maybe allow the system to be pushed harder without overheating. I'm speculating though.
 

lattjeful

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I could very well be wrong, but it's likely the performance is just capped when in handheld mode? The dock has a fan this time around, so better cooling could maybe allow the system to be pushed harder without overheating. I'm speculating though.
Nah, looks like a 30 FPS cap in the footage we have. I think we'll have bigger differences in docked and handheld graphics settings this go around.
 

lattjeful

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Pricing discussion aside, talking about this thing with others is so frustration. Some people treat it as a crime to suggest that this brand new handheld with the whole Nvidia suite of stuff (DLSS, RT) is stronger than the three year old Steam Deck. I'm not saying it's a better product mind you; that's gonna come down to if you value the seamlessness of a console + Nintendo's exclusives, or having something more tweakable + your Steam library more, but just that the hardware is no doubt better.

I think Steam/Valve fanboys are my least favorite people on the Internet and that makes sense considering they're the Gibson fanboys of the video game world.
 
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